what version hdmi does azbox have, will it pass through dts hd?

[moontan]

Will the azbox output dts hd or dts ma from a full blu ray rip if you have it connected to an amp that decodes HD audio? The popcorn hour seems to do this so am wondering will the azbox do this (as i'm looking at get a new amp).

[tinos]

HDMI is 1.1 only so no DTS-HD. Popcorn Hour A100 is also HDMI 1.1 and won't output DTS-HD.

AzBox can output AC-3 and DTS but up to HDMI 1.1 limitations.

[moontan]

thanks for the reply, i was thinking it was going to be 1.1/1.2

the popcorn a110 has hdmi 1.3a


suppose its not a great loss, but it would have being nice to have

[DJBlu]

thanks for the reply, i was thinking it was going to be 1.1/1.2

the popcorn a110 has hdmi 1.3a


suppose its not a great loss, but it would have being nice to have

HMDI is 1.3 on the AZBox HD

http://www.sigmadesigns.com/public/Products/SMP8630/pdf_files/SMP8630_br.pdf

Take a look at the chipset brochure

[goran]

I was wandering what's what here, yeah... I only use HDMI and it's going through Home Theatre and all works fine... All of it is 1.3, I think...


Supports HDMI v1.3 with advanced
audio and xvYCC

Thanx for the info, guys!:respect-048:

[moontan]

HMDI is 1.3 on the AZBox HD

http://www.sigmadesigns.com/public/Products/SMP8630/pdf_files/SMP8630_br.pdf

Take a look at the chipset brochure


same brochure says hdmi 1.2 on second page, still think it more than likely is less than 1.3a whatever it is

i emailed opensat through their website so hopefully they reply ( if they say its hdmi 1.3a and usb blu ray support was added...........me happy)

[gtg60]

Yes, the Sigma site is as clear as mud!
Here's another link:
http://www.sigmadesigns.com/public/Products/selection_guide/selection_guide.html

And it lists it as v1.2 with xvYCC but only v1.3 has xvYCC! :07:

[tinos]

It is only hdmi 1.1 or 1.2 but not 1.3 for sure... I have seen the chips on my motherboard.

Silicon Image Sil9030CTU-7 is the chip for HDMI and audio:
_http://www.semiconductorstore.com/pdf/newsite/siliconimage/9030_PB.pdf

The -7 is an updated version with 1080p but specs show only hdmi 1.0 (think that is also a typo... probably 1.1 as on other specs for the same chip list 1.1 for blueray players using same chip).

[goran]

Now, this is worrying... or at the least - confusing...

WTF are the:

1) processor manufacturers producing

2) stating to us - the specs, that is

3) what are their "customers" [in this case Opensat] building into their machines [in this case AZbox HD] ?

In food you must clearly state the ingredients. So, WTF?!?:willy_nilly:

[tinos]

Confusing is because probably it is HDMI 1.0 but HDCP 1.1 and numbers mix together or something similar. Same with xvYCC and YCbCr some mix them too.

But only important fact is HDMI before 1.3 and after. Our HDMI output is before 1.3, so it doesn't pass DTS-HD or True-HD. Not a real requirement for our AzBox... (we can do DD+ for BlueRay).

HDMI 1.1 added DVD-Audio and 1.2 added support for low voltage.

HDMI 1.3 adds HD audio and Deep Color + xvYCC (double bandwidth)

There is a very good table at bottom here:
_http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-Definition_Multimedia_Interface

We are probably on 1.0 to 1.2 features (anything above 1.0 doesn't really matter, unless you want a highend BlueRay player).

[goran]

Aha, that makes it clearer... ;) :)

Cheerio!

[valerica]

With 2163 , I tested Yes Man movie which has Dolby D and DTS . Both r passed throu HDMI to my LCD . So it's just a matter of drivers/codecs .

Cheers ,
Val .

[hija31]

It supports 1.3



Hello,



It supports 1.3 HDMI.



With kind regards,

Herbert V.

Azboxhd.eu

[tinos]

Wow... great news then... could be possible, according to this info on Sony BR it was using the old revision of the Sigma chipset. We are probably using the latest rev C chipset with updated features:


2. The S300 has the older DSP chip, Sigma SMP8634LF Revision A. This chip with a FW update can decode DD TrueHD. It does not output DD-TrueHD or DTS-HD MA bitstreams. Even if the S300 did have HDMI 1.3 ouputs, it would still be incapable of bitstreaming DD TrueHD or DTS-HD MA. The Sigma SMP8634LF Revision C is the only chip in this series that can bitstream DTS-HD MA. However, the plain Sigma SMP8634LF chip (no Rev #) can bitstream DD TrueHD but not DTS-HD MA. None of these older chips decode DTS-HD MA. IOW, your S300 lacks the DSP processing power to decode or bitstream the DTS-HD MA. You will get the higher bit rate core signal at 1.536 Mbps which is pretty decent sound but still lossy audio.

[goran]

Cool, very good to know, ta!!:coolgleamA:

[gtg60]

It supports 1.3

Pretty impressed they took time to answer your question, thought they'd have been very busy!

[zeini]

hdmi 1.3 Lip Sync is supported. Where is this feature?

[gtg60]

hdmi 1.3 Lip Sync is supported. Where is this feature?

Not all possible features may be/ are implemented at this time, we're still in Beta remember?

[tinos]

Also you need a TV or AV Receiver that is 1.3 compliant:
_http://www.abccables.com/info-lip-sync.html

[zipperolo]

It is only hdmi 1.1 or 1.2 but not 1.3 for sure... I have seen the chips on my motherboard.

Silicon Image Sil9030CTU-7 is the chip for HDMI and audio:
_http://www.semiconductorstore.com/pdf/newsite/siliconimage/9030_PB.pdf

The -7 is an updated version with 1080p but specs show only hdmi 1.0 (think that is also a typo... probably 1.1 as on other specs for the same chip list 1.1 for blueray players using same chip).

What about these limitations? Aren't they incompatible with the reply hija31 got from OpenSat?

As an AZBox owner of course I'd be more than happy if the HDMI version was in fact 1.3, but since I'm about to change some pieces of my home theater, and the AV receiver is one of them, before going ahead I'd want to be sure I won't have surprises when I try to play some HD-DVD or BR content. It wouldn't be nice to upgrade to a trueHD / DTS-MA capable device only to discover that the AZBox can just output the legacy core signal which my current receiver handles no problem already.

So, can anybody confirm that they actually tried that out and trueHD or DTS-MA audio was actually being passed thru the HDMI connection?

[tinos]

The Silicon Image is HDMI 1.1 (but some places show it as HDMI 1.2a, so maybe there is even a 1.3 revision) but the SMP8634LF Rev C is HDMI 1.3... don't really know which one is more important. But probably Sigma, maybe Silicon Image is only used for audio codecs decoding... so sigma can do bitstream for HD audio, cannot really tell. Unless they lie we could assume that 1.3 is supported as told.

Testing right now is imposible unless we were able to playback BlueRay movies... currently high bitrate playback is not working. So until some new firmware comes out nobody can really test.

Also might be that True HD support comes later after some basic BlueRay playback features... so it could be time before we can really test it.

For DVB-S/S2 using HDMI 1.1 is more that enough... 1.3 is a good bonus if anyone wants to use it as BR player with USB drive.

If you buy a new AV Receiver worst case scenario is that it will be used for Dolby Digital+ streams... already a good thing even with HDMI 1.1

[zipperolo]

The Silicon Image is HDMI 1.1 (but some places show it as HDMI 1.2a, so maybe there is even a 1.3 revision) but the SMP8634LF Rev C is HDMI 1.3... don't really know which one is more important. But probably Sigma, maybe Silicon Image is only used for audio codecs decoding... so sigma can do bitstream for HD audio, cannot really tell. Unless they lie we could assume that 1.3 is supported as told.

What got me thinking is the fact the Popcorn Hour A100 was HDMI 1.1 while the A110 is HDMI 1.3a, and appearently they have the same processor, so it would seem the culprit was the PH equivalent of our Silicon Image chip.

But of course it could also be that the two SMP8635 CPUs are different revisions as well, with the one of the PH A110 being the rev. C version. As far as I know the SMP8635 is just a SMP8634 without macrovision support, so it's likely they had the same evolution.

If the Silicon Image HDMI chip ends up being fundamental for having full HDMI 1.3 support, perhaps we could still get DTS-MA and trueHD decoding done by the Sigma Chip and sent as multichannel PCM to the receiver via HDMI. Multichannel PCM is supported since HDMI 1.0 so it shouldn't be a problem to do that.

[tinos]

No... if you read info SMP8634 Rev C does bitstream of TrueHD and DTS-HD not decoding... so you need a new AV Receiver to decode. But those formats are not supported on DVB-S/S2 only AC3 (DD) is an option.

You will need a highbitrate file or BlueRay to test...

The Popcorn Hour A-110 uses the newer Silicon Image Sil9134CTU with HDMI 1.3 but maybe is using older revision Sigma... so don't really now if newer Sigma comes with more stuff making the Silicon Image not necessary to do HDMI 1.3.

We can only hope that azboxhd.eu is telling the truth and it is real HDMI 1.3 too. Because maybe it supports 1.3 means it can connect to HDMI 1.3 TVs... hope not. Maybe at some TV menu info you can check if HDMI connected is 1.1 or 1.3?

[zipperolo]

From that thread you quoted on the Sony S300 which has revision A of the AZBox Chip (emphasis is mine):


1. It doesn't have HDMI 1.3, only HDMI 1.1. It is incapable of bitstreaming DTS-HD MA or DD-TrueHD for that matter.

2. The S300 has the older DSP chip, Sigma SMP8634LF Revision A. This chip with a FW update can decode DD TrueHD. It does not output DD-TrueHD or DTS-HD MA bitstreams. Even if the S300 did have HDMI 1.3 ouputs, it would still be incapable of bitstreaming DD TrueHD or DTS-HD MA. The Sigma SMP8634LF Revision C is the only chip in this series that can bitstream DTS-HD MA. However, the plain Sigma SMP8634LF chip (no Rev #) can bitstream DD TrueHD but not DTS-HD MA. None of these older chips decode DTS-HD MA. IOW, your S300 lacks the DSP processing power to decode or bitstream the DTS-HD MA. You will get the higher bit rate core signal at 1.536 Mbps which is pretty decent sound but still lossy audio.

So it seems that at least for TrueHD that older revision could certainly decode it. Are you completely sure rev. C of the same chip can't decode DTS-MA? It says that the older versions lack the power to decode DTS-HD but doesn't say anything about the newer ones.

Edit. It seems the SMP8634LF rev C can in fact decode DTS-MA:
A post from a Pioneer representative:


I can 100% confirm that the BDP-95FD will NOT decode DTS-HD Master.. The main reason is that the sigma 8634 Rev A chip that is in the BDP-95FD cannot handle this task.. The Sigma 8634 Rev C. can accomplish this task, however I am not aware of a player that uses this version yet (Maybe the new Samsung)...

Chris Walker
Pioneer Electronics

Now it would be nice if we could get a confirmation that the chip in the AZBox HD is indeed rev.C.

Anybody willing to remove the heatsink:respect-039:?

[tinos]

Wow!!! Great news then... amazing! This chip is a beast!!! he he he

Now I need to confirm that HDMI 1.1 can pass 5.1 channel PCM... because usually BR players used analog outputs for that. And toslink SPDIF doesn't do it.

Thanks! I am pretty confident that our chip is Rev C... maybe we can find info on /proc/cpuinfo compared to old revision...

Update:
_http://209.85.229.132/search?q=cache:_INpiCRAaMwJ:www.a vsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php


HDMI 1.1
- Provides up to 8 (7.1) channels of lossless uncompressed PCM audio.
- Provides all pre-HDMI Dolby and DTS formats (5.1/6.1).
- Provides DVD-Audio streaming as PCM.

So you just need an AV Receiver with 5.1 PCM support on HDMI.

[goran]

...tried now...

AC3 as default - on Premiere - it's ****, as it's always in German, hehe... I mean, Edith Piaf singing on AC3 [German], of course, is still the original, but if I go to the original sound [PCM I put in the A/V settings] it's much better, clearer, stronger/louder etc.

I have a Panasonic Home Theatre [7.1 but with only 4 speakers, plus the Panasonic plasma built-in speakers] SA-BX500, "incorporating HDMI" (v.1.3 with Deep Colour 4096 seps colour gradation)...:woohoo-022:

Grooooovvvyyyy.......:king-041::biggrinjester::respect-048:

:respect-051:

[tinos]

So you tested your Panasonic Home Theathre decoding AC3 stream from AzBox versus AC3 decoded internally on AzBox and Sigma kicks *ss decoding? or you just changed audio format with remote?

All via HDMI to AV Receiver, AC3 bitstream versus PCM decoded? It would be interesting to know if it will do PCM at 48Khz or 96Khz... for HD audio it should be 96Khz...

[tinos]

Now it would be nice if we could get a confirmation that the chip in the AZBox HD is indeed rev.C.

Anybody willing to remove the heatsink:respect-039:?

You do it first! :respect-059: he he he

[FME_fta]

Yes the SIGMA chip in Azbox HD is revision C:
_http://www.sat-filez.com/pics/azbox/az%20011.jpg
(this foto is from an Elite without heatsink)

Regards.

[goran]

So you tested your Panasonic Home Theathre decoding AC3 stream from AzBox versus AC3 decoded internally on AzBox and Sigma kicks *ss decoding? or you just changed audio format with remote?

Changed the sound format via remote, yes...

I didn't re-cable anything. Both HD components go to Home Theatre via HDMI fully wired cables [AZbox HD, BD 35], then one goes to TV.


All via HDMI to AV Receiver, AC3 bitstream versus PCM decoded? It would be interesting to know if it will do PCM at 48Khz or 96Khz... for HD audio it should be 96Khz...

Echhhh, but how to...? [scratch, scratch]

[zipperolo]

From wikipedia:


HDMI 1.0 was released December 9, 2002 and is a single cable digital audio/video connector interface with a maximum TMDS bandwidth of 4.9 Gbit/s. It supports up to 3.96 Gbit/s of video bandwidth (1080p60 Hz or UXGA) and 8 channel LPCM/192 kHz/24-bit audio.

So unless that artitle is wrong, it seems all HDMI versions can carry 8 channels of uncompressed 192KHz LPCM audio. All HDMI-complying AV receivers which are not just pass-thru but actually handle HDMI content should be able to take care of that kind of streams.

Current HD audio formats are 96 Khz, so all in all even HDMI 1.1 is enough future-proof to allow for a further doubling of audio sampling rate before its quality limit is met.

[tinos]

Yes! I think the important fact is that the Sigma chip is Rev C then they can probably workout all codecs inside and stream bitstream or PCM to the AV Receiver.

They claim it also comes with HDMI 1.3 support... but worst case scenario HDMI 1.2a (as Silicon Image does) will do for us.

[tinos]

Changed the sound format via remote, yes...

I didn't re-cable anything. Both HD components go to Home Theatre via HDMI fully wired cables [AZbox HD, BD 35], then one goes to TV.



Echhhh, but how to...? [scratch, scratch]

Ok... if you just change with remote the you change from 2 channel mix (stereo) to AC3 decoding (sounds lower volume and dull on TV).

You could also try with Settings there was something like AC3 bitstream or PCM selection so using remote to select AC3 you can try how will internal Sigma decoding work (PCM) versus your AV Receiver decoding (bitstream).